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Author Topic:   Atlantis References that Predate or are Contemporary with Plato
Gwen Parker
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posted 03-30-2005 21:26     Click Here to See the Profile for Gwen Parker     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Rockessence,

There really aren't any links to Hellanicus other than what has already been provided. Only a fragment of his "Atlantis," exists.

Atalante,

I can see how Hellanicus' writings might relate to the line of Hesiod's, both concerning the "daughters of Atlantis." I can even see how Plato would be inspired to use the name "Atlantis" to coin a name of an ancient land in the sea. What I can't see exactly is just how much else the accounts of Hellanicus and Plato actually have in common with one another. It is good of you to explore this link. Would you care to go into it again in a little more detail?

quote:
In Solon's lifetime (ca 600-570 BC), an epic poem was circulating titled "The Geryones", which had been written by the epic poet Stesichorus. Today only fragments of Stesichorus survive. But scholars are sure that it dealt with the region slightly outside the straits of Gibralter, and with a visit by the mythical Heracles to steal the cattle of Geryon.

Are there any fragments of this poem? It, too, sounds like it might have something to do with what we're discussing here.

Loved the goddess links, by the way. I'm convinced that Atlantis worshipped the goddess and were the ones to spread the culture throughout the Mediterranean.

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Absonite
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Registered: Dec 2003

posted 03-30-2005 21:56     Click Here to See the Profile for Absonite     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Gwen,

The goddess worship began among the followers of Cain. Cain's father of course was mortal while his mother was supermortal, a true goddess. As the generations and centuries passed the goddess mother was remembered and worshipped while the offspring of Adam & Eve, both supermortal, were remembered and worshipped fairly equally or slightly biased in favor of the male due to physical strength.. Cains father Cano, was virtually forgotten although I believe Rockessence has found some reference to Cano or perhaps I am mistaken and that was from Riven.

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atalante
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From: Tucson AZ USA
Registered: Apr 2003

posted 03-31-2005 07:37     Click Here to See the Profile for atalante     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
Gwen,

Various pages on the website theoi.com have organized many of the fragments of Stesichorus into coherent bundles.

Here are two that I recommend, to demonstrate the themes of the Geryones epic poem. http://www.theoi.com/Okeanos/Kallirrhoe.htm
and http://www.theoi.com/Pontos/Geryon.htm

As you can see from the existing fragments, the epic was telling about Chrysaor migrating to the region of Gades/Gadeira, where he had a son named Geryon.

This myth can be generally framed in time. The dating would be based on comparable events that are recorded in traditional Greek mythology. Perseus, the founder of Mycenae (and hence the initial phase of Mycenaean Greek culture) made an initial, mythical, visit to Lake Tritonis in northwest Africa. While he was at Lake Tritonis, Perseus killed the snake goddess Medusa; and the blood that drained out of her dying body turned into Chrysaor, who then migrated westwardly, to the region west of the straits of Gibralter.

Modern archaeologists have determined that Myceanaen culture began around 1450 BC in Greece. So it follows that Stesichorus's epic called Geryones (i.e. about Perseus/mycenae and the founding of Tartessos, etc., near Gadeira) should be taking place around 1400-1200 BC.

Plato's comment in Critias, that Solon's Egyptian priest was talking about the era of Cecrops, Erichthonius, etc. (while the priest was describing the Atlantean war), is evoking a similar era, roughly 1500-1350 BC.

The epic named Geryones become obsolete after it was rewritten by a later author, thus becoming better known as the 11th labor of Heracles.

Since Solon was a poet, and since the poetry of Stesichorus was widely praised in Greece while Solon was alive, it follows that Solon was familiar with the theme of the Geryones.

Plato's material in the Critas dialog was composed while Stesichorus's works still existed. Therefore Greeks who were contemporary with Plato would find it credible that Solon had tried to research the basic story of the Geryones poem.


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Chronos
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posted 03-31-2005 08:48     Click Here to See the Profile for Chronos     Edit/Delete Message   Reply w/Quote
You were right about the usage of the name "Atlantis," in line 238 of Theogony, of course. I should have thought to check out the original Greek translation before I posted my own opinion on it. My apologies.

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