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Author
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Topic: ATLANTIS & the Atlantic Ocean
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-16-2005 21:03
Atlantic OceanAtlantic Ocean, the second largest of the earth's four oceans and the most heavily traveled. Only the Pacific Ocean is larger. It covers about twice the area of the Atlantic Ocean. The Atlantic is divided into two nominal sections: The part north of the equator is called the North Atlantic; the part south of the equator, the South Atlantic. The ocean's name is derived from Atlas, one of the Titans of Greek mythology. Boundaries and Size The Atlantic Ocean is essentially an S-shaped north-south channel, extending from the Arctic Ocean in the north to the Antarctic continent in the south and situated between the eastern coast of the American continents and the western coasts of Europe and Africa. The Atlantic Ocean proper has a surface area of about 82 million sq km (about 31,660,000 sq mi). Including its marginal seas-the Gulf of Mexico-Caribbean Sea, the Arctic Ocean, and the North, Baltic, Mediterranean, and Black seas-the total area is about 106,190,000 sq km (about 41 million sq mi). The boundary between the North Atlantic and the Arctic Ocean is arbitrarily designated as lying along a system of submarine ridges that extend between the land masses of Baffin Island, Greenland, and Scotland. More clearly defined is the boundary with the Mediterranean Sea at the Strait of Gibraltar and with the Caribbean Sea along the arc of the Antilles. The South Atlantic is arbitrarily separated from the Indian Ocean on the east by the 20° east meridian and from the Pacific on the west along the line of shallowest depth between Cape Horn and the Antarctic Peninsula. Geologic Formation and Structural Features The Atlantic began to form during the Jurassic period, about 150 million years ago, when a rift opened up in the supercontinent of Gondwanaland, resulting in the separation of South America and Africa. The separation continues today at the rate of several centimeters a year along the Mid-Atlantic Ridge. Part of the midoceanic ridge system that girdles the world, it is a submarine ridge extending north to south in a sinuous path midway between the continents. Roughly 1500 km (about 930 mi) wide, the ridge has a more rugged topography than any mountain range on land, and is a frequent site of volcanic eruptions and earthquakes. The ridge ranges from about 1 to 3 km (about 0.6 to 2 mi) above the ocean bottom. Along the American, Antarctic, African, and European coasts are the continental shelves-embankments of the debris washed from the continents. Submarine ridges and rises extend roughly east-west between the continental shelves and the Mid-Atlantic Ridge, dividing the eastern and western ocean floors into a series of basins, also known as abyssal plains. The three basins on the American side of the Mid-Atlantic Ridge are more than 5000 m (more than 16,400 ft) deep: the North American Basin, the Brazil Basin, and the Argentina Basin. The Eurafrican side is marked by several basins that are smaller but just as deep: the Iberia, Canaries, Cape Verde, Sierra Leone, Guinea, Angola, Cape, and Agulhas basins. The large Atlantic-Antarctic Basin lies between the southernmost extension of the Mid-Atlantic Ridge and the Antarctic continent. The Atlantic Ocean has an average depth of 3926 m (12,881 ft). At its deepest point, in the Puerto Rico Trench, the bottom is 8742 m (28,681 ft) below the surface. Islands The largest islands of the Atlantic Ocean lie on the continental shelves. Newfoundland is the principal island on the North American shelf; the British Isles are the major island group of the Eurafrican shelf. Other continental islands include the Falkland Islands, the only major group on the South American shelf, and the South Sandwich Islands on the Antarctic shelf. Oceanic islands, usually of volcanic origin, are less common in the Atlantic Ocean than in the Pacific. Among these are the island arc of the Antilles (including Puerto Rico, Hispaniola, Jamaica, and Cuba). In the eastern Atlantic, the Madeiras, Canaries, Cape Verde, and the São Tomé-Príncipe group are the peaks of submarine ridges. The Azores, Saint Paul's Rocks, Ascension, and the Tristan da Cunha group are isolated peaks of the Mid-Atlantic Ridge system; the large island of Iceland is also the result of volcanic action at the Mid-Atlantic Ridge. Bermuda rises from the floor of the North American Basin, and Saint Helena from the Angola Basin. Currents The circulatory system of the surface waters of the Atlantic can be depicted as two large gyres, or circular current systems, one in the North Atlantic and one in the South Atlantic. These currents are primarily wind driven, but are also affected by the rotation of the earth. The currents of the North Atlantic, which include the North Equatorial Current, the Canaries Current, and the Gulf Stream, flow in a clockwise direction. The currents in the South Atlantic, among which are the Brazil, Benguela, and South Equatorial currents, travel in a counterclockwise direction. Each gyre extends from near the equator to about latitude 45°; closer to the poles are the less completely defined counterrotating gyres, one rotating counterclockwise in the Arctic regions of the North Atlantic and one rotating clockwise near Antarctica in the South Atlantic. See Ocean and Oceanography: Ocean Currents. The Atlantic receives the waters of many of the principal rivers of the world, among them the Saint Lawrence, Mississippi, Orinoco, Amazon, Paraná, Congo, Niger, and Loire, and the rivers emptying into the North, Baltic, and Mediterranean seas. Nevertheless, primarily because of the high salinity of outflow from the Mediterranean, the Atlantic is slightly more saline than the Pacific or Indian oceans. Temperatures The Atlantic Ocean may be described as a bed of water colder than 9° C (48° F)-the cold-water sphere-within which lies a bubble of water warmer than 9° C-the warm-water sphere. The warm-water sphere extends between latitude 50° north and latitude 50° south and has an average thickness of about 600 m (about 2000 ft). The most active circulation is found in the uppermost layer of warm water. Below this, circulation becomes increasingly sluggish as the temperature decreases. Surface temperatures range from 0° C (32° F), found year-round at the Arctic and Antarctic margins, to 27° C (81° F) in the broad belt at the equator. At depths below 2000 m (about 6600 ft), temperatures of 2° C (36° F) are prevalent; in bottom waters, below 4000 m (about 13,200 ft), temperatures of -1° C (30° F) are common. Marine Resources A remarkable example of plant life is found in the Sargasso Sea, the oval section of the North Atlantic lying between the West Indies and the Azores and bounded on the west and north by the Gulf Stream. Here extensive patches of brown gulfweed (Sargassum) are found on the relatively still surface waters. Actively mined mineral resources in the Atlantic include titanium, zircon, and monazite (phosphates of the cerium metals), off the eastern coast of Florida, and tin and iron ore, off the equatorial coast of Africa. The continental shelves and slopes of the Atlantic are potentially very rich in fossil fuels. Large amounts of petroleum are already being extracted in the North Sea and in the Caribbean Sea-Gulf of Mexico region; lesser amounts are extracted off the coast of Africa in the Gulf of Guinea. http://www.cartage.org.lb/en/themes/GeogHist/histories/history/hiscountries/A/atlanticocean.html
[This message has been edited by dhill757 (edited 02-16-2005).]
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-16-2005 21:06
Volcanoes of the Atlantic OceanThe Global Volcanism Program Holocene volcano database for Canary Islands currently contains 6 volcanoes, sorted below in geographical (volcano number) order. Photo Volcano Name Volcano Type Location ------------------------------------------------------------------------ LA PALMA Stratovolcanoes Canary Islands HIERRO Shield volcano Canary Islands TENERIFE Stratovolcano Canary Islands GRAN CANARIA Fissure vents Canary Islands FUERTEVENTURA Fissure vents Canary Islands LANZAROTE Fissure vents http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/region.cfm?rnum=1803
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-16-2005 21:07
Volcanoes of the Atlantic OceanThe Global Volcanism Program Holocene volcano database for Cape Verde Islands currently contains 3 volcanoes, sorted below in geographical (volcano number) order. Photo Volcano Name Volcano Type Location ------------------------------------------------------------------------ FOGO Stratovolcano Cape Verde Islands BRAVA Stratovolcano Cape Verde Islands SAO VICENTE Stratovolcano Cape Verde Islands http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/region.cfm?rnum=1804
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-16-2005 21:09
The Global Volcanism Program Holocene volcano database for Azores currently contains 13 volcanoes, sorted below in geographical (volcano number) order. Photo Volcano Name Volcano Type Location ------------------------------------------------------------------------ FLORES Stratovolcano Azores CORVO Stratovolcano Azores FAYAL Stratovolcano Azores PICO Stratovolcano Azores SAN JORGE Fissure vent Azores GRACIOSA Stratovolcano Azores TERCEIRA Stratovolcanoes Azores DON JOAO DE CASTRO BANK Submarine volcano Azores SETE CIDADES Stratovolcano San Miguel I UNNAMED Pyroclastic cones San Miguel I AGUA DE PAU Stratovolcano San Miguel I FURNAS Stratovolcano San Miguel I MONACO BANK Submarine volcano Azores ------------------------------------------------------------------------ The following locations in this region are not related to known Holocene volcanoes, but have been the subject of a report in the Bulletin of the Global Volcanism Network: Azores-Gibraltar Fracture Zone http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/region.cfm?rnum=1802 [This message has been edited by dhill757 (edited 02-16-2005).]
IP: 69.11.252.197 |
dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-16-2005 21:11
Volcanoes of the Atlantic OceanThe Global Volcanism Program Holocene volcano database for Atlantic Ocean (central) currently contains 6 volcanoes, sorted below in geographical (volcano number) order. Photo Volcano Name Volcano Type Location ------------------------------------------------------------------------ UNNAMED Submarine volcano ? Central Atlantic Ocean UNNAMED Submarine volcano Central Atlantic Ocean UNNAMED Submarine volcano Central Atlantic Ocean UNNAMED Submarine volcano Central Atlantic Ocean ASCENSION Stratovolcano Central Atlantic Ocean TRINDADE Stratovolcano Central Atlantic Ocean http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/region.cfm?rnum=18
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-16-2005 21:12
Volcanoes of the Atlantic OceanThe Global Volcanism Program Holocene volcano database for Atlantic Ocean (southern) currently contains 3 volcanoes, sorted below in geographical (volcano number) order. Photo Volcano Name Volcano Type Location ------------------------------------------------------------------------ TRISTAN DA CUNHA Shield volcano Southern Atlantic Ocean BOUVET Shield volcano Southern Atlantic Ocean THOMPSON ISLAND Submarine volcano ? Southern Atlantic Ocean http://www.volcano.si.edu/world/region.cfm?rnum=1806
IP: 69.11.252.197 |
dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-16-2005 21:13
Volcanoes of the Atlantic OceanThe Global Volcanism Program Holocene volcano database for Atlantic Ocean (northern) currently contains 3 volcanoes, sorted below in geographical (volcano number) order. Photo Volcano Name Volcano Type Location ------------------------------------------------------------------------ UNNAMED Submarine volcano Northern Atlantic Ocean UNNAMED Submarine volcano Northern Atlantic Ocean UNNAMED Submarine volcano Northern Atlantic Ocean ------------------------------------------------------------------------
IP: 69.11.252.197 |
Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 02-17-2005 20:54
dhill757 and others,Check out this Alluvial Map of Atlantis I just updated on my website. Click "Where" and scroll down. www.mts.net/~perasa
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-17-2005 22:40
Nice map, Riven, I like the way you worked out the contours of Atlantis, it almost seems to match the famous sixteenth century Kircher map of Atlantis. What time period are you placing this in?
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Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 02-18-2005 13:53
That is a good question dhill757;Basically just after the ice age or around 10,000 bC for the visible land. The Sub-continental island sank in different stages which would be before and after the Ice Age. I guess we would need professional proof to confirm exactly when those lands would have been above water. Such as, what the depth of the Celtic shelf would be. We know that around 10k bC the oceans would be around 2-300 metres lower. Maybe you could confirm that for us which fits with your thread topic. What lands would in fact be above water at that time of 10,000 bC.
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Boreas Member Posts: 433 From: Namsos, Norway Registered: Jan 2004
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posted 02-18-2005 15:35
Riv, Have you seen the southern border of the geolittic ice-cap? We may start in the Rockies, down to Colorado, then crossing straigth east to the Appalaches and Virginia. Then what?Then the edge of the Cap continued - straigth east, rigth into the Atlantic, SOUTH of the 40 altitude. Covering 50 degress, all up to the 90 altitude, being the North Pole. How far out into the Atlantic Ocean did the ice-cap reach? From Virginia it went along the 40 altitude, bending sligthly northward until we close in on the 45th LONGITUDE, - straigth south of Greenland. There it started bending northwards - from the 40th to the 52 altitude, hitting Ireland and England who was both massivly covered, except from the southern parts. The bend have continued to sharpen, as the coal of Newcastle was under ice, the Danish penninsula was NOT. Thus our Scandinavian geologists are drawing the edge of the ice-cap along the east-coast of Brittain across the North Sea to the Scandinavian South Cape, where it continues to cover 95% of Scandinavia, crossing the Botnic Ocean and covering 90-95 % of Finland. Simultaniously we have had a large continental ice-sheet covering Northern Germany, as well as Austria, Switzerland, Tchechia and Poland, before hitting onwards to the east - north of Ukraine (and the Black Sea) and The Caspian Sea - reaching the Himmalayas and eventually the Pacific Ocean, - at the northern islands of Sakhalin. According to the last geological update I have seen there was; "no chance of people passing the Bering Straigth before 8.500 BP." Which means that the Meso-Americans do have a past beyond ice-age. Which means that they were there already BEFORE ice-time. As well as DURING. And AFTER. Plainly and simply, - like 1-2-3. That this does not fit with the "established views" doesnt change anything. Not at all. There are recent discoveries in the Americas that clearly shows traces of civil life more than 12.000 and 18.000 years back in time. Now even 30.000 years old fragments are found, claiming to bear witness of human presence. Than we start understanding that the genetic and cultural variations of North and South America have evolved over tens and hundreds of millenias - to fit with the time when a galactic event occured, producing a cataclysm that turned into ice-age. Thats how big the ice-cap used to be, about 40-20.000 years ago. Still 12.000 years ago it was all quite intact, - but between 10. and 12.000 years ago something caused a total and dramatic change. The result was the collaps of the giantic ice-cap, - as it broke up into regional sheets and pieces. From then on the southern edge of the cape came to press south only over land. If we relate to the different "Cape Agdes" existing on modern maps we may find traces of the later border-lines of the Atlantean sector of the maxima ice-cap.
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docyabut Member Posts: 3717 From: toledo .ohio Registered: Mar 2000
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posted 02-18-2005 16:41
Now even 30.000 years old fragments are found, claiming to bear witness of human presence in the Americas? Boreas there is no real evidence of that.
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Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 02-18-2005 16:50
Apparently the celtic sea shelf ranges in general from 100-200 metres in depth. There are also a number of shallower banks encountered in the deeper parts of the Sea, including Labdie Bank,Jones Bank, and the Great Sole Bank that range upto 1500 metres. http://www.ngo.grida.no/wwfneap/Publication/briefings/CelticShelf.pdf It would be safe to say the range is 100-400 metres for the Celtic sea shelf. http://www.bgs.ac.uk/products/digbath250/ http://www.jncc.gov.uk/PDF/JNCC325-maps_and_plates.pdf The location for the Amperes seamount Atlantis, would be roughly 800 km (480)miles, from the Straites of Gibraltar.
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Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 02-18-2005 16:55
Here's an excellent Bathymetric map someone posted for me in Hancock's forum; http://topex.ucsd.edu/srtm30_plus/images/w020n40.Bathmetry.srtm.tiff.jpg Atlantis primordial hill would lie around 35'N 14'W [This message has been edited by Riven (edited 02-18-2005).]
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Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 02-18-2005 17:52
Atlantis Royal City should lie about 800 kms past the Straites of Gibraltar, around 36' N/14'W. (The Brown dot in the center ahead of the Horseshoe Abyssal plain(Amperes,Gettysburg seamounts) would have served for the site of the enormous canal described by Critias. (100m deep by 300m wide). The primordial hill(Ta-Tenen, Cleito) most likely was slightly above/right of the city(large hilly area). http://topex.ucsd.edu/srtm30_plus/images/w020n40.Bathmetry.srtm.tiff.jpg On either side of the Horseshoe Abyssal Canal location, you can see how the 2 Harbours would fit in. The next (top of picture NE)circular land North of the Gettysburg Seamount (larger area,hill) is the Tore seamount where a meteorite crashed according to geological surveys of the Atol. The fascinating thing is that around 10,000 bC this land would have been above water where a mean depth on average of 200m could be related to that land now below water. The Celtic Shelf varies from 100-400m below sea level with mean depths upto 1500m in other abyssal plain locations. At the bottom right of this next map we also see the Seat of Saturn off the NWestern coast of Portugal.(light green/brown) http://topex.ucsd.edu/srtm30_plus/images/w020n90.Bathmetry.srtm.tiff.jpg At the top right corner of this map above Iceland and on the Shores of Greenland you can make out definite circle. Either an extinct Volcano, which we can see long lava trails or a meteorite impact. http://topex.ucsd.edu/srtm30_plus/images/w060n90.Bathmetry.srtm.tiff.jpg http://topex.ucsd.edu/WWW_html/mar_topo.html This map shows the Azores and that strange land below it that looks like a warrior holding a sword and Cape Verde lower right. http://topex.ucsd.edu/srtm30_plus/images/w060n40.Bathmetry.srtm.tiff.jpg
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Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 02-18-2005 20:06
Pacific, Atlantic and Indian Ocean (46,000BP to 1867 - Historical Pre-Science http://sharpgary.org/FisheryTimeline.html
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-18-2005 23:28
Riven,I like the direction your research is taking. In answer to your question, "which lands would be above water at the end of the last Ice Age," that is a difficult question. In addition to the fact that the oceans were nearly four hundred feet lower than they are today, adding more land to the coastliness and expanding the size of islands, there is also something called Tectonic Uplift to factor in. Some areas in the ocean would be raised higher and some lower. If something dramatic happened to end the last Ice Age, then this would fit neatly in with that. As Rand Flem-Ath says on his website: quote: Evidence for submerged lost civilizations of the Ice Age may be 'deeper' than a simple ocean rising model assumes. Computer models that don't take the tectonic collapse consideration into their calculation can seriously miss the mark. They can give false readings by assuming greater depths are equal to greater age when much of the depth might be accounted for by tectonic collapse. Such a shift of the crust would be accompanied by volcanoes and earthquakes but vertical shifts should be largely restricted to the tropics. The tectonic uplift and collapse wouldn't happen all at once. There could be significant (many centuries possibly thousands of years) delay in establishing a new equilibrium.
I put the list of volcanoes in the Atlantic Ocean (most of which have never been named, let alone explored), because I wanted to show just how volcanic and earthquake prone the whole Atlantic ocean is. I have a theory I'm working on concerning the volcanoes, but it's not fully researched yet, so I'm keeping it to myself for now. You're right, we do need a professional to examine some of this. I will look for some more good Ice Age maps this weekend and see if I can find any that are helpful.
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Boreas Member Posts: 433 From: Namsos, Norway Registered: Jan 2004
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posted 02-19-2005 00:36
Dockey, Agree. The evidences are not clear. But they are certainly older than 8.500 years, rigth?The geological investigations of the Taimir-area and the Kamchatcka Penninsula have led american geologists (too) admit that a immigration over the Bering-straigth "around 9.000 years ago" to be "merely wishful thinking". Even 8.500 years ago the climate was still "extreme arctic" in this area - not to mention that entire coastline of Alaska was "un-habitable" before 8.500. And there are still no arhaeological evidences of mesolittic setlements in this supposed "proto-region" of the meso-americans?! The earliest east-coast american so far seems to be the Kennewick-man, some 9.200 BP. If he is Caucasian he could have been arriving to lake Michigan, then via Missouri reached west to the end of the Columbia River, where he was found. But what the heck. We still dont have any scientific statement regards the etnic background of this man. How can they avoid publishing the genetic analyzis of these remains? Or are we to believe that the US Forensic expertise really cant get a "clean sample" from the complete relics of a man?! [This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-19-2005).]
[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-19-2005).]
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rockessence Member Posts: 1000 From: WA USA Registered: Feb 2004
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posted 02-19-2005 00:50
Boreas,You must mean the earliest west coast american...The altercation over the remains is not over yet. At this point the scientists have been granted a small amount of material by the court, and the Tribal concerns have decided not to sue any further at this time...They may assert their rights in the future, but at this point it appears the remains will not be quickly re-buried as was originally asked for.
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Boreas Member Posts: 433 From: Namsos, Norway Registered: Jan 2004
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posted 02-19-2005 01:12
Rock, Yes, and. If he couldnt come from the WEST, - he must have arrived via the EAST coast.Thats the whole point. If he IS a "Caucasian", - and not only a look-alike...
[This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-21-2005).]
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rockessence Member Posts: 1000 From: WA USA Registered: Feb 2004
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posted 02-19-2005 01:54
When I first heard of Kenniwick man I was thinking that perhaps that if the timing was co-existant with a climatic optimum, sailors could have come around the Arctic Ocean by way of Asia or by way of No.Canada, then south past the Aleutians down the west coast. Any possibility of that?
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Boreas Member Posts: 433 From: Namsos, Norway Registered: Jan 2004
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posted 02-19-2005 08:31
dh, Tx for nice words on Dr. Heyerdahl. He was not happy when the stroke hit, - because it disturbed his daily schedule. According to his widow he was very content and happy - during the last weeks with the family. He did reech the understanding that "the truth about our cultural history is already in sigth - now it`s merely a matter of time. Just keep working..."So, - here are some more stuff that happen to come out on different part of "The Pond", as the sailors use to call the North-Atlantic. From the Meso-American Utah, today Zion National Park; Circle/Whirl/Three-of-Love, Backpackers, Goats, Dogs, Spirals, The Salmon Serpent – over Spiral and the Exited man. http://www.climb-utah.com/Zion/zionrockart1.htm From mesolittic/neolittic Europe; The Three Serpents going together in a whirl. See The “Midgard Serpent” (Note the teeth) and the “Salmon Serpent ” (note the swan-beak). http://www.gotmus.i.se/fornsalen/bildstenar/bilder/bild_smiss_nar_a1.jpg The male and female Serpents joins; http://www.gotmus.i.se/fornsalen/bildstenar/engelska/sanda.htm Royal person, Snake, Circle, Whirl, Dog, Deer, Three-of-Love, Crown, Sirkel, Triple Triangel (ref. triple-snakes) and Okko. Scroll down to 6th-10th pictures; http://freepages.history.rootsweb.com/~catshaman/19Edda/09Eddagods2.htm [This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-20-2005).]
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 02-20-2005 22:03
Boreas,I didn't know you knew Thor Heyerdahl, that must have been very interesting. It's still hard to believe the man sailed the Pacific in just a kin-tiki raft. That took a lot of guts. I don't think that anyone can possibly underestimate the contributions he made to ocean exploration. But he wasn't a big believer in Atlantis, though, wasn't he? Also, did you ever talk with about the Bock Saga, and, if so, what was his opinion on it?
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Boreas Member Posts: 433 From: Namsos, Norway Registered: Jan 2004
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posted 02-22-2005 18:34
dh, The first time we discussed this matter was in 1993. His first reflected reply was simply; "Well, that all depends on reliability. If the man is honest or not."By and by we both -separatly - figured out that the story-teller was actually pointing to completly unknown facts of Nordic history, during the recordings of 1984-87 - that were completly unknown to contermporary science. Such as the existence of a human population and culture in Finland, during ALL of ice-time. Before 1995 there was NO evidence that man walked in Finland before the end of the great ice-age, 9.500-9.900 years ago. But after the astounding discoveries of 1995 - of the 120.000 years old habitat in SW Finland, exactly as the saga described. Than there were strong reasons to check this saga further. In 1997 did we get the results from the large investigation of the Pechora Bassin, east of the White Sea, confirming a hunter/gather-society of homo sapiens sapiens, just about 40.000 years old. Thus, in 1995-97 he started going into this part of Eurasian history. In 1999 and 2001 he published his two last books, both about Aser and Vaner - and the historic reality behind these "gods". The interest was very clear - and together with the University at Rostov he organised a larger excavation in Asov, - a city Heyerdahl explained as "Asernas Hov" ("Hall of Aser") - a place explicitly named as a turn-key in the Icelandic Sagas, to find the real location of "Odin". He just managed to finnish the first stage of this project. The next summer he was scheduled for Gotland, Helsinki and Novgorod, in addition to Asov, the Cuban underwater-city and Samoa, where a 30 metre high pyramid was discovered, etc. The remark quoted above was his last comment in the matter, - just a week before he got hospitalized. In retrospect I think he felt that his health was swaying at the time, although nobody else could guess. But I sure remember the particular weight (stress) he expressed in that chat - on the importance of proceeding - without doubt or delay. Thats why I miss the guy the most. With him still around we would have had fewer and less delays...
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George Erikson Member Posts: 210 From: Desert Hot Springs, CA USA Registered: Aug 2002
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posted 02-24-2005 12:08
Boreas,Kennewick Man (9200 BP)may not be from the east coast. All that has been determined is that he is doliocephalic, having a long and narrow skull. So his ancestors were not the broad-faced, round skulled northern Asians, nor were his descendants amerindians. He may, however, have been from the South Pacific. www.AtlantisInAmerica.com
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George Erikson Member Posts: 210 From: Desert Hot Springs, CA USA Registered: Aug 2002
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posted 02-24-2005 13:02
Kennewick Man is not the only doliocephalic skull that has been found in the Americas. A rescontruction of the cranium of "Luzia" (11,300BP) found by Walter Neves in south-central Brazil, reveals craniofacial patterns of a Polynesian. 33 skulls of Pericue "Indians" - a now extinct tribe that lived in southern Baja California when the Spainsh arrived in the 1520s - have been dated at 10-12,000 YBP. All resemble the Brazilian skull. A particularly well-preserved skull was recently excavated by Dr. Sylvia Gonzalez. Found in an ancient lakebed near Mexico City the skull, dubbed Penon Woman, has been radiocarbon dated to 12,700 BC. Penon Woman appears similar to "Australians and populations of the south Pacific Rim," says Dr. Gonzalez of Liverpool John Moores University, adding "we've extracted her DNA...it is going to be a bomb."
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Boreas Member Posts: 433 From: Namsos, Norway Registered: Jan 2004
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posted 02-24-2005 13:11
Rock, The climatical optimum hadnt kicked in yet, - if we go by the Greenland ice-core-tests. They are conclusivly setting 8.000 BP as the very startpoint - and 7.500 as a "sure thing" - in terms of a summer mid-temperature as high/higher than 11,8 C, todays midle in mid-Scandinavia and SW Greenland.I have heard that this should be the minimum average to get wheat to ripen, - i.e. to exist. Large leaf-threes have about the same minimum to develop ripe seeds, elm at 11,2 and oak at 11,7 - if I remember rigth, - while dwarf-birch, birch and other pollen occur at significantly lower temperatures. Consequently the Danish researchers have a pretty good clue, as the core-test have been processed for about 15 years already. Today they process a time-span of 170.000 years, - and there are still many important results/repports to come. ----- George, I couldnt find the reference-page of the Kennewick-case. Could you specify the adress?
Ops! DNA? Cant wait for that bomb! (And - Why cant they admit that they already have detected "a bomb" in the Kennewick-case? The tests that have been made is still not published. The reason given from the responsible institute was "difficult tissue, risk of pollution". The risk was said to be "pollution" from the researchers themselves, as dna from their body could pollute the tissue before it reached the "microscope". Very funny - seems they been finding somebody with genes like their own. Which makes the whole thing tricky off course, - but its very easy to make a duplicate test, with chineese or japaneese laborants... The controversial result is probably the real reason to why they need a new "round" of tests - under criterias that are extremly well controlled, checked - and double-checked. In duplo. Maybe they need Dr. Sanchez` expertise? [This message has been edited by Boreas (edited 02-24-2005).]
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George Erikson Member Posts: 210 From: Desert Hot Springs, CA USA Registered: Aug 2002
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posted 02-24-2005 14:19
Boreas,Try http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/1/hi/sci/tech/3634544.stm
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George Erikson Member Posts: 210 From: Desert Hot Springs, CA USA Registered: Aug 2002
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posted 02-24-2005 14:27
Also http://www.pbs.org/nova/stoneage/
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 03-01-2005 23:05
quote: Scientists to drill beneath oceansBy Robert S. Boyd Inquirer Washington Bureau WASHINGTON - In a research program getting under way this summer, shipboard scientists will punch thousands of holes in the ocean bottom and take samples from greater depths than ever before. They will be investigating the biology, chemistry and physics of "inner space," the vast world hidden beneath the seas.
The Integrated Ocean Drilling Program, led by American and Japanese scientists, begins in June with a 10-month expedition to plumb the crust beneath the Pacific and Atlantic Oceans. The layers of rock below the seafloor are an archive of global change, tens of millions of years old, that scientists say can help them understand what's happening to our world today. Researchers are especially interested in hordes of microbes thriving in a complex "plumbing system" of life-supporting fluids coursing through cracks in the rocks thousands of feet below the ocean bottom. Some organisms may have medical or commercial value. "There's a whole ecology living down there," said Theodore Moore Jr., an oceanographer at the University of Michigan. "It's very likely some species will be of direct benefit to humans." Some scientists believe life on Earth may have begun in these gloomy caverns far from sun and air about four billion years ago. If life exists on other planets or moons, they say it may be found in similar dark environments, sheltered from lethal cosmic rays and meteor bombardments. The new international drilling project, involving researchers from 20 countries, is a stepped-up successor to a smaller, American-led Ocean Drilling Program that ended last fall. Over 18 years, from 1985 to 2003, the U.S. research ship JOIDES Resolution bored about 2,000 holes at 650 different sites around the world, making many significant scientific observations. For instance, an expedition a year ago in the tropical Atlantic turned up evidence, buried in seafloor sediment, of repeated episodes of rapid global warming that led to massive plant and animal extinction in the distant past. "Without exploring the basics of how these systems work, we can't have confidence in our ability to predict their behavior on shorter time scales, like human lifespans," said Margaret Delaney, an ocean scientist at the University of California, Santa Cruz. As part of the new program, researchers also will investigate how events at the ocean bottom can touch off dangerous earthquakes and volcanic eruptions. "The dynamics of the Earth's interior processes... have a major financial and safety impact," Delaney said in an e-mail. On its latest voyage, scientists aboard the Resolution successfully matched the chemistry and geology of portions of the seafloor off Newfoundland to similar formations off the coasts of Spain and Portugal. The match confirmed that North America and Europe once belonged to a single continent that split apart about 145 million years ago, opening the way for the formation of the Atlantic Ocean. Previous drilling operations have: Confirmed the theory of plate tectonics, which describes the breakup and movement of the continents. Discovered the mid-ocean ridge, a 40,000-mile underwater mountain chain encircling the globe like the laces on a baseball. Studied the great ocean currents that control temperatures on land. Located traces of enormous sheets of ancient lava as much as 20 miles thick that spewed from undersea volcanoes. One such deposit covered almost four million square miles on the bottom of the Atlantic, stretching from eastern Canada to Spain and Africa's Ivory Coast. Despite these achievements, most of the ocean floor and interior remain virtually unknown, project scientists acknowledge. The new program will have two research vessels at its disposal. A Japanese drill ship, the Chikyu, now under construction, will begin operations in 2006. The U.S. National Science Foundation is seeking $100 million for a more capable vessel to replace the 26-year-old Resolution, which will be retired in Galveston, Texas, next year. Before it puts away its drill bits, the Resolution will make one more cruise under the auspices of the international program. The voyage will start June 24 in the Northeast Pacific, studying the biology and geology of the seafloor off the coast of Oregon, Washington and British Columbia. Next fall and winter, the Resolution will move to the North Atlantic near the Azores, Greenland and Iceland. It will also try to drill a hole in the seafloor of the Arctic Ocean. "This will be the first time we've ever done that," Moore said. "We don't have any idea what we're going to find." The U.S. National Science Foundation, the Japanese Ministry of Education, Culture, Sports, Science and Technology, and the European Consortium for Ocean Research Drilling are sponsoring the research. Countries in Europe and Asia are expected to share operating costs of $160 million a year when both ships are at work. "Located traces of enormous sheets of ancient lava as much as 20 miles thick that spewed from undersea volcanoes. One such deposit covered almost four million square miles on the bottom of the Atlantic, stretching from eastern Canada to Spain and Africa's Ivory Coast." "For instance, an expedition a year ago in the tropical Atlantic turned up evidence, buried in seafloor sediment, of repeated episodes of rapid global warming that led to massive plant and animal extinction in the distant past." Both these could have something to do with Atlantis. Depending on how long it took for the lava to accumulate, Atlantis could be beneath the lava. "Repeated episodes of global warming that led to mass plant and animal extinction" also implies times where the Ice age could have come to an end quickly, bringing about massive tsunamis and flooding. Whatever we think we know, it is plain from the article that we still need to learn a lot more about the oceans.
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 03-10-2005 00:20
quote: A 'Lost City' Found Under the SeaTowering white mineral chimneys and feathery spires mark the field deep in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean. Far, far below the surface there is a strange new world never before known to human beings. It's been named the Lost City for the mythical world of Atlantis. Populated by see-through shrimp, crabs, and some very unusual life forms, the Lost City is a field of thermal vents that was discovered by accident in 2000 when researchers were looking at undersea areas near the midocean ridge. In 2003, scientists explored the area through 19 eight-hour dives in the deep-sea submersible Alvin and in 2005 recorded what they saw in the journal Science. The discovery shows "how little we know about the ocean," lead researcher Deborah S. Kelley of the University of Washington told The Associated Press in an interview. "I have been working on black smokers for about 20 years, and you sort of think you have a good idea what's going on. But the ocean is a big place, and there are still important opportunities for discovery." The Lost City, which is at roughly the same latitude as Jacksonville, Fla. and is perched on the plateau of a mammoth undersea mountain, has startled scientists with its different environment and residents. Black smokers they know. These white chimneys are something entirely new. AP reports that black smokers are chimney-like structures that form when very hot water--700 degrees Fahrenheit--breaks through the ocean floor and comes into contact with frigidly cold ocean water. Minerals crystallize in this very acidic environment and that gives the chimneys their black color. But the Lost City is different. The temperature of the escaping fluids is a lukewarm 150 degrees to 170 degrees. In addition, the environment is extraordinarily alkaline. All this makes the crystalline chimneys white. When the scientists got a good look at the inhabitants of the Lost City and this new type of ecosystem, they must have felt as if they had journeyed to a different planet. Among the 65 creatures are miniature shrimp and crabs, most of which are transparent or translucent, that are less than a half-inch in size. There are also tubeworms, water fleas, mats of bacteria, and snails. One scientist who was not associated with the research team called the amount of living organisms found inside the Lost City's chimneys astonishing. It's possible the undersea vents mimic conditions on the primordial earth when life first formed so they may provide some of the best insights into that process, reports The Seattle Times. This undersea work was funded by National Science Foundation, the NASA Astrobiology Institute and the Swiss National Science Foundation. In addition to the University of Washington, researchers from Duke University; ETH-Zentrum in Zurich, Switzerland; Woods Hole Oceanographic Institution; the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration; and the Massachusetts Institute of Technology participated.
http://cnn.netscape.cnn.com/news/package.jsp?name=fte/lostcity/lostcity
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Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 03-11-2005 12:34
Theosophical Maps of Atlantis http://www.sacred-texts.com/atl/soa/soamap.htm
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 03-12-2005 02:28
Great find, Riven, I never noticed them at Sacred Texts before.It's interesting that they call Atlantis "Ruta" as that was the name for Lemuria on the other side of the world.
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Mauricius New Member Posts: 14 From: Rome Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 03-26-2005 15:42
late reply, but still :P let's not forget that in 2005, we have unique species of animals in Mozambico(Africa) or NewZealand(Oceania)(Cangaroos and Koalas ONLY in Australia)
an Island usually saves his own fauna i wouldnt be surprised if Atlantis was in Azores, that they had a "locale" specie of Mammooth OR Elephant ( considering also that if that Island/Continent existed, was surely one of the most close to Africa (looking at the whole Globe) who knows.
[This message has been edited by Mauricius (edited 03-26-2005).]
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dhill757 Member Posts: 526 From: Madison Registered: Mar 2004
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posted 03-27-2005 08:28
Great point, Mauricius, and mastodon and woolly mammoth bones have been dredged up along the Mid-Atlantic Ridge in the past (helping to prove, to me, anyway, that there was once inhabited land there). Although it might interest Essan to know that I am still looking for the pictures.
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unknown Member Posts: 256 From: Pontiac, MI. Oakland Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 03-27-2005 10:44
Has anyone here read Otto Muck's book "The Secret of Atlantis" he gives some compelling arguments for Atlantis in the Atlantic and a theory to explain the disappearance of the island. A great read I highly recommend for those interested in the study of Atlantis
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Melissa MacQuarrie Member Posts: 26 From: Registered: Feb 2005
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posted 03-27-2005 21:08
I've read the Otto Muck book and found it very interesting. It's one of the few books that gives a believable explanation for how the catastrophe could have happened (a object from space striking the brittle crust of the Mid-Atlantic Ridge).
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unknown Member Posts: 256 From: Pontiac, MI. Oakland Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 03-28-2005 17:38
There is also some stuff about how the sinking of atlantis supposedly changed the course of the Gulf stream bringing warm air currents there parcipiting the melting of the ice sheets. I also found the mystery of the Sargossa sea eels intriguing, swimming all the way across the ocean to spawn in fresh water,[This message has been edited by unknown (edited 03-28-2005).]
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Riven Member Posts: 1655 From: Canada Registered: May 2003
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posted 03-30-2005 13:15
I don't think any of you should miss this picture. http://www.perseus.tufts.edu/cgi-bin/image?lookup=Perseus:image:1987.09.0172 I have posted some info in Tribes relating to Aeantis Athena and the Tribe of Aeantis.
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unknown Member Posts: 256 From: Pontiac, MI. Oakland Registered: Mar 2005
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posted 03-30-2005 18:44
RivenInteresting, like a little Atlantis in minature. mountain in background, plain with rings whole bit.
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