"What's my problem?"

We are all fair game for a good "smackdown" as our discussions can get quite heated solely on their merits or lack thereof. I think we are all grown up enough to handle an opposing viewpoint.

However, "have you stopped beating your ____?" ...Absonite, turn those words upon yourself. From a purely technical viewpoint, it doesn't win you any debating points. And there's no honor in expressing such a sentiment.

I have taken the time to read all your posts over the last few months and consider you to be the Atlantis Rising specialist on Urantia. Now if Bob Sarmast has found something worthy of our attention - and if he has relied on the Urantia texts to do that, then your thoughts are equally worthy. Time will be the test.

What would impress me (Absonite) is if you took the "49 points" that Sarmast claims to have used to determine the location of this possible Atlantis and explain how and why the Urantia text(s) were a legitimate source to use.

The wife comment was perfectly appropriate in response to the drive-by slanderous innuendo of johnE. It was cheap and uncalled for.

Do you actually believe that this finding can actually die now without someone having to be a huckster or good salesman?
John, Plato's texts are so distorted that neither the time period, nor the location confusion, nor his incorrect size of Atlantis could lead to the discovery off Cyprus, On the whole Earth, only the Urantia papers could have done that.. I'm sure many of Plato's features about Atlantis are correct and as you say....time will tell.

tick....tick....tick.....tock !

.

"Note to Catastrophe: Lets await further developments, can we not? Rome wasn't built in a day....neither was Atlantis."

Life is too short.

And I was not the one who used the word scam.

Not sorry to see the Uranter is back. With friends like that Bob does not need enemies or even critics!

Enough of that, though. I am disappointed by just little discussion actually seems to be taking place about the actual discovery itself.

For one:

*Are their pictures or any physical evidence of this discovery?

*Is any additional information forthcoming other than what has been heard on the news?

*If not, will Mr. Sarmast at least be returning to the forum to discuss his findings with the rest of us?

The first pictures of Robert´s expedition are in
http://www.discoveryofatlantis.com/
just on top of the page.

It seems that with his equipment he could make only sonar mapping, but no diving operation.

He got money from the Urantia believers, and he was seeking for the Eden of Urantia. We cannot exclude that he found it. Maybe he has more detailed pictures than those shown in the link.
A structure like that shown in the computer animation must not necessarily be manmade. It could as well be formed by nature; we should ask a specialist in underwater geology.

But when it was Eden, why did it need a defence wall ?

And why does he call his discovery Atlantis ?
There are no traces of the´circular canals as they were described by Plato.

The 6 day long, privately-funded $200,000 expedition has confounded or at least confused sceptics by bringing back scientific side-scan sonar data which supports evidence from previous scans of the Eastern Mediterranean revealing man-made structures (including a 3km long wall, a walled hill summit and deep trenches) - plus old river beds - in exactly the formation and proportions that Plato himself described for the Acropolis Hill of Atlantis City in his works of 2,400 years ago.

"But when it was Eden, why did it need a defence wall ?"

the surrounding tribes from the "underworld" were primitive cro-magnon and neanderthal types 38,000 years ago. Any intelligent society would wisely provide itself with some defence from unauthorized access. The primary mission of the garden was the biological uplift of the evolutionary races by the offspring of Adam & Eve.

"And why does he call his discovery Atlantis ?"

Because they are one and the same. He knows it, I know it, others know it, and now you know it.

"There are no traces of the´circular canals as they were described by Plato."

nice to see you around. you asked......

"A silly question, if I may, but it has been awhile since I read "Discovery of Atlantis." Isn't Cyprus a little small to have been Atlantis, or are we to assume that "larger than Libya and Asia combined" actually meant "in the middle of Asia and Libya," as is commonly held by the Santorini people. "

Apparently this translation has always been a problem and as it becomes more understood, the time period of the original Eden/Atlantis is far older than believed. Of course after Atlantis sank 34,000 years ago the migration of the offspring spread out for 34,000 years all around the Mediterranean and many even returned to the area from the second garden location between the Tigris and Euphrates. 34,000 years is a long time to some.

As far as size goes, the Cyprus/Atlantis area was quite sufficient for the following.......

"At the center of the Edenic peninsula was the exquisite stone temple of the Universal Father, the sacred shrine of the Garden. To the north the administrative headquarters was established; to the south were built the homes for the workers and their families; to the west was provided the allotment of ground for the proposed schools of the educational system of the expected Son, while in the "east of Eden" were built the domiciles intended for the promised Son and his immediate offspring. The architectural plans for Eden provided homes and abundant land for one million human beings.

(Deep water sonar scanning had indicated man-made structures on a submerged hill, including a wall, a walled hill summit and deep trenches.

Further explorations were needed, he added.

A decent computer program can originate better pictures.

Don't lose this opportunity to exhibit more rudeness absonite. Just show us what urantia is all about. Puerile rudeness seems to be the message.

"With great skill, insight and wit Martin Gardner reveals how modern cults arise and the extent to which believers develop a mind-set that becomes impossible to alter regardless of how strong the evidence is against those beliefs."

Had you forgotten?

Glad to see you back here with that sharp scientific wit of yours. Since you like to quote that little piece about mind sets, could you explain just how it is relevant in this case? I mean, "impossible to alter regardless of how strong the evidence is against those beliefs." What are the beliefs that you are referring to and what is the evidence against those beliefs that you are offering? Or, do you simply like to take meaningless quotes out of context and wave them around .
I find it more interesting that Bob Sarmast discovered exactly what he was looking for, exactly in the way it was described, exactly where he knew it would be. Is this the evidence against those beliefs that you were referring to? Of course I don't expect you to answer with any substance. Stick with Brig, he apparently needs your keen clarity and tremendously important insight and always remember his eternal truths..... "by the time Adam was smart enough to build a wall he had already been driven fron Eden for disobeying God." What an envious team. I have to go now and find my fig leaf.
.

I'm not so sure that "live and let live" is a spiritual "truth".

"I find the Urantia book a cracking read...much more interesting than the Bible and I will be evaluating it based on its spiritual content, rather than its origins, during my meditation."

Very insightful Damsi.

"whether you like it or not because there are just not enough enlightened souls out there."

that's a bit disturbing isn't it.

"Because Plato is more acceptable for joe normal right?"

Right.

"Remember it’s the content that counts but only to those who are ready to "feel the truth of it in their hearts" to quote Robert."

nice quote....... probably a spiritual truth.

"Frustrating isn't it when you discover something that rings true to your heart but you can't get others to see it too? Maybe it just isn't their truth, maybe they are not ready and just maybe they are making their own way along the Shakti path...none of these people are lesser souls because they don't know the truth about how the world was created...they just have different lessons to learn. Does it matter if one chooses the path of knowledge and another the path of divine love?"

Yes, it does, the divine love path is the true one. Yes, it is frustrating, but truth is truth and not one's perception of it. It is universal, but it appears that you certainly have a nice working relationship with it.

I don't think I launched an "unprovoked attack" on you, I merely stated that the work was not channeled when you stated it was and offered you the proof of that. Might I suggest that you research channeling a bit deeper, at least in the 1930's, and find out why Dr. Sadler, Sir Hubert Wilkins and Howard Thurston......"They all agreed that the phenomena connected with this individual could not be classified with other types of psychic phenomena such as automatic writing, telepathy, clairvoyance, trances, spirit mediumship, Êchanneling, or split personality."

"All the man said was that the Med was littered with ancient civilizations and that whatever is found might not be Atlantis. It would be hard even for the average man to distort that or to disagree with it. It was my job to merely report what he said word for word. Distorted would be if I had quoted anyone out of context or twisted their words."

Well, then I think you have failed because if I recall correctly, he did not use the word "might", and your insertion of that little word changes the whole meaning of what the irresponsible so-called "remote viewer" actually said. I don't even know why any responsible journalist would include his comments at all in a piece about Sarmast and his recent discovery of Atlantis.

German physicist disputes Atlantis discovery claim by American

German physicist Christian Huebscher

Is this all you got for the money? LOL

this sounds like that, that sounds like this, I believe this, I don't believe that, prove this, prove that,...... blah blah, blah blah......

show me,........ give me a sign,....... blah....blah..blah !!!!

.

Absonite
Live and let live = judge not and thou shalt not be judged’
You judged me, my integrity, my journalistic abilities and my spiritual knowledge in a single paragraph, not to mention hinting that i was a liar based on one post suggesting that Robert had been hasty in mentioning the Urantia connection “at this early stage”.

And just in case you still can’t grasp my spiritual insight above you might understand the way it is written here;
“Relate yourself to every man as if you were in his place. Recompense injury with kindness”. “If some one irritates you, causes feelings of resentment, you should sympathetically seek to discern his viewpoint, his reasons for such objectionable conduct. If once you understand your neighbor, you will become tolerant. (The Urantia Book)

While you might sometimes display a lack of tolerance I do see very clearly that you tell the truth...of course without thought as to how damaging it might be to Robert’s expedition. Consider something you posted in the last day or so.
“On the other hand John, Plato's texts are so distorted that neither the time period, nor the location confusion, nor his incorrect size of Atlantis could lead to the discovery off Cyprus, On the whole Earth, only the Urantia papers could have done that.. I'm sure many of Plato's features about Atlantis are correct and as you say....time will tell”. Can I quote you on that?

Robert came here and announced to the whole world via the media that you seem to loathe, except when they report what suits you, and he said more times than I can count that he was looking for Atlantis ‘BASED ON’ Plato’s writings. Yes there is the vague ‘little footnote’ on the Urantia book but no indication of the important role it is playing in all this. And he collected $20,000 from the Cyprus Tourism Organisation (CTO) based on this premise. Is this honest and truthful based on what you have said above?

I wonder who else gave money to look for Plato’s Atlantis when clearly (according to you) his writings “could never lead to the discovery off Cyprus”. If Robert had gone to the CTO and told them he believed Atlantis and the Garden of Eden were one and the same, based on the Urantia papers, with a little Plato thrown in, he would not have gotten a cent. I know because I asked them.

Which brings me to a question I asked last time, which you didn’t answer yet.
Why not state the Urantia connection to the public at large right from the outset if, as you say, it is the ONLY thing that could pinpoint Cyprus as Atlantis? Truth is truth isn’t it? Or is that selective too like using the parts of Plato that conveniently fit? And those that don’t correspond with the Urantia book’s descriptions are described as “distorted”.

Take this quote from Robert to a Urantia newsletter: “My research shows that Atlantis is just another name for the Urantia Book’s first Garden of Eden, and the UB’s description of Eden strongly matches the underwater formation near Cyprus. The truth in the spiritual concepts of the Urantia
Papers is something that must be realized through inner contemplation, but Eden is something tangible and I imagine that its discovery would be of vital importance to the Urantia community”.

Why not tell this to the mainstream media? Either Urantians have the faith and trust in their beliefs to proclaim them to the world as the truth they believe them to be…and if not, why not? I know the answer. Because you could not persuade the London Times and BBC and Reuters to come and listen, and without them there would be no global show. The local press might have gone along out of curiosity but as Robert’s PR told me last Saturday “Robert is not really interested in the local press”.
There is a story here but it’s not about Plato and Atlantis.

One last question. Could you please point out the so-called lies in my article on Psychognosia? And don’t say the whole thing because that is a cop out. You picked up on the word ‘might’, which I used in the post. What Knowles said was “they must know in their hearts it’s not Atlantis”.
I never used the word ‘might’ in my story and the story is up there for all to see so I really don’t know what your point is.
I didn’t hear you complain about my earlier articles on Robert, one of which went out on a global news agency and is posted on his website, as is the one I wrote last Saturday for the newspaper.

Is this how you are going trash the article on the German physicist as well because his statements contradict your beliefs? Well he must be a liar as well then, along with the journalist whose job it is to report his side of things.
Reporters on all the other international agencies that picked up on the story such as Agence France Presse should also be taken out and shot or maybe you could ‘bore’ their wives too.
Not a very spiritual comment on the part of someone who accuses others of being spiritually ignorant. I’ll simplify that for you. “It’s like the pot calling the kettle black”

What really ticks me off is that you have quite wrongly assumed that I was trashing the Urantia book, or knocking Robert’s quest as futile. All of us who live in Cyprus know we are living on a paradise island that might very well have been the Garden of Eden.

I am approaching this from a journalistic point of view and what I do object to is being taken for a ride by people who kiss a** when they want ‘positive’ publicity and then have the nerve to complain when others with opposing viewpoints are given the same opportunity as themselves. I still fail to see how that is ‘irresponsible’ as you say.

I’m sure I will get a another lecture from you on my inabilities and shortcomings and how dare I quote the Urantia book at you when I know nothing about it blah blah…I can read…so as far as I’m concerned that’s a good enough reason to throw bits of it back at you.

I’m telling you from now that I will not respond. I’ve wasted enough time on you. Frankly you are more full of sediment than the Acropolis Hill must be...not for your beliefs in the Urantia book but for the way you go about preaching them and trashing anyone who gets in your way.

“The fruits of the divine spirit which are yielded in the lives of spirit-born and God-knowing mortals are: loving service, unselfish devotion, courageous loyalty, sincere fairness, enlightened honesty, undying hope, confiding trust, merciful ministry, unfailing goodness, forgiving tolerance, and enduring peace. If professed believers bear not these fruits of the divine spirit in their lives, they are dead; the Spirit of Truth is not in them.” (Urantia book)

Therefore you Absonite are a very bad advertisement for both the spirit of the teachings of the Urantia Book and for Robert Sarmast’s expedition…and I am being kind.

Since you have already closed the coffin and nailed the lid shut nice and tight there would be no point in my trying to develop anything further here.

One thing I don't quite understand though, is that you start your little tirade with this thing about how high and moral you are by not judging and you end up making a major judgement in the end. In fact your entire rant is all geared to build up to this final judgement of me and my character.

And, all this comes after I said so many nice things about you. I don't understand, help me out will you?

Then, you post this remarkable little gem just after telling me how truthful I am......
"The fruits of the divine spirit which are yielded in the lives of spirit-born and God-knowing mortals are: loving service, unselfish devotion, courageous loyalty, sincere fairness, enlightened honesty, undying hope, confiding trust, merciful ministry, unfailing goodness, forgiving tolerance, and enduring peace. If professed believers bear not these fruits of the divine spirit in their lives, they are dead; the Spirit of Truth is not in them.” (Urantia book)"

So, what is it Damsi, am I dead or am I alive?

Then you ask me a bunch of questions that it appears you really want the answer to, and then you jump to saying you're out of here and you have already wasted too much time on me, ..... blah blah blah.

Besides that you insinuate that Bob might be misleading people because he used several sources to find the Atlantis he has been interested in since childhood. You imply that this supposed deception should somehow be exposed in this "other story" that is neither Atlantis nor Plato.

In an earlier post of yours you mention something about not "exposing" Robert because he wasn't doing something "criminal".

You're whole little tirade also seems to be pre-occupied not with finding Atlantis, but with money. Who donated it, who invested, etc.
you even write:......"I know because I asked them. "
If this, if that, would you have done this or that.

You're going down some strange avenues Damsi and I for one am not interested anymore. I don't trust you or your motives and what you say or write can't be believed or trusted. You also feel pretty slighted because Robert's press told you they weren't interested in the "local" media..... whatever that means. I'm sure it didn't really go down the way you say. Robert appears to be an honest and sincere gentleman passionately involved in his expeditions to find Atlantis and using every source on earth to help him succeed. If you wish to try to discredit him or find some dirt somewhere as a feather in your cap or for some kind of journalistic license or maybe just a couple more pieces of silver, that will be your spiritual journey. If you wish to discredit or trash the Urantia papers somehow, that's already been done by sharper tacks than yours. Get in line.

If, on the other hand I have completely mis-judged you Damsi, please accept my apologies. I've been wrong before and I will be wrong again.

Besides, you don't need to hear anything I say, I'm not a Urantia or Bob Sarmast spokesman, and you are quite capable of asking and answering your own question,''

"Why not tell this to the mainstream media? Either Urantians have the faith and trust in their beliefs to proclaim them to the world as the truth they believe them to be…and if not, why not? I know the answer. Because you could not persuade the London Times and BBC and Reuters to come and listen, and without them there would be no global show. The local press might have gone along out of curiosity but as Robert’s PR told me last Saturday “Robert is not really interested in the local press”.
There is a story here but it ’s not about Plato and Atlantis."

........

"Is this how you are going trash the article on the German physicist as well because his statements contradict your beliefs? Well he must be a liar as well then, along with the journalist whose job it is to report his side of things.
Reporters on all the other international agencies that picked up on the story such as Agence France Presse should also be taken out and shot or maybe you could ‘bore’ their wives too.
Not a very spiritual comment on the part of someone who accuses others of being spiritually ignorant. I’ll simplify that for you. “It’s like the pot calling the kettle black” "

"You judged me, my integrity, my journalistic abilities and my spiritual knowledge in a single paragraph,"

That's just your perception, but, Pretty good huh? no wasted words or paper.
and besides I didn't want to "bore" you.
Let's see You do all that in only one paragraph.

Oh, excuse me, you probably get paid by the word, so you need a lot of paragraphs to do that.

.

Evidently you did not find it because your deficiency is still showing.